flag-burning

[danohu]

palmer1984 just posted a meme that touches on flag-burning. I've always been bewildered by the (mainly American?) objection to burning flags. But if you accept that flag-burning is Bad and Wrong...

How do True Patriots care for their ageing flags? Are they stored indefinitely? Given heroic burial (cremation presumably isn't an option)? Is there a patch of desert somewhere, where old flags fly until they disintegrate completely?

The military are big on flags and big on rules; they must have some baroque procedure for getting rid of the old ones.

Also: I've only come across the obsession with flag-burning in an American context. Are there equally small-minded patriots in the UK and elsewhere?

Comments

[atreic.livejournal.com]

In comments on this elsewhere, a friend wrote:

"* Does it make difference to your price whether you burn the flag during the federally-recommended flag honourable disposal ritual, or as an insult to America, or neither?

(Notice: people actually are paid to do the first. I wonder what the breakdown of flags burnt are, in categories of "official", "anti-America", "protest breaking of the constitution", "annoyingly ironic/artistic", "other" and "whoopsie" :)


So apparently the right way to get rid of flags is to burn them. But it's OK when the good guys do it.

[atreic.livejournal.com]

Genuine Website?

[oedipamaas49.livejournal.com]

ah, that's truly disturbing touching.

[feanelwa.livejournal.com]

To be fair, that logic holds for human bodies.

[gerald_duck]

The "The United States Flag Code" Wikipedia article reaches this apparently authoritative page in Cornell University's Law School which says "The flag, when it is in such condition that it is no longer a fitting emblem for display, should be destroyed in a dignified way, preferably by burning."

The flag has a symbolism in the USA that's extremely rare elsewhere. I only realised the full extent of the problem (and yes, I think it's a problem) when I read the first chapter of Almost Heaven — a book which I recommend as fascinating in many respects.

[oedipamaas49.livejournal.com]

'particularly of the Muslim variety'

Interesting; I always imagine it in terms of the late '60s - Vietnam protesters and the like. Guess I'm behind the times.

I'll defer to your knowledge on whether it's a myth. I'd thought of the flag in the US as roughly equivalent to the monarchy in the UK: something of little practical importance that people enjoy defending or desecrating depending on their background.

[I also thought that any flag-burning law would have to be a constitutional amendment - so the supreme court would be irrelevant, but Congress would have to sniff a *lot* of glue]

fire starter

[(Anonymous)]

Yeah, middle eastern demonstations seem to go in for it a fair bit. Whether that be the stars and streipes, danish flag, whatever.

New Labour mooted introducing a flag burning law over here a couple of years ago (when crusher Reed was home office dude) but it got quietly dropped. The one good thing about such a law is that flag burning would rocket... I've always wanted to burn a union jack - preferably in front of fascists - I hope one day I'll get my wish.

Jim http://jimjay.blogspot.com

[palmer1984.livejournal.com]

There are some situations in which flag burning would be inappropriate. For instance, burning the flags of newly independent African countries in the 60s would have been appropriate :). And I wouldn't burn an Iraqi flag now. However, I think British and American flags are fair game :).

[oedipamaas49.livejournal.com]

did you miss a 'not' at some point there?

either way, I'm confused.

Why do you think British and American flags are fair game, but others not? Is that just because you, as British, feel you don't have the right to criticise weaker countries? If a Chadian activist wanted to burn her country's flag, what would be wrong with that?

[palmer1984.livejournal.com]

For instance, burning the flags of newly independent African countries in the 60s would not have been appropriate :).

I think it would be pretty racist for a British person to burn the flag of an ex-colony just after it had been liberated.

If a Chadian activist wanted to burn her country's flag, what would be wrong with that?

Nothing.

[palmer1984.livejournal.com]

So yes, there should have been a not there! Sorry for the mess of comments trying to fix this :)

[bloodofareptile.livejournal.com]

We still burn them. :-p

It is 'disrespectful' to fly a worn flag, so you are supposed to take it down, fold and store it properly, then have it burned in a ceremony (generally on labor/memorial day and done by American Legion/vets associations though I am sure there are others).

Other bit of interesting flag trivia, you are not supposed to fly it at night unless it is lit! Supposed to take it in every dusk and raise it at dawn (or, more accurately, when you get around to it).

[lavendersparkle.livejournal.com]

Your post gave me the image on Americans having flag geniza.

[oedipamaas49.livejournal.com]

That's exactly the image I had, although I'd never heard of geniza.

[l-j-b.livejournal.com]

I think the British attitude to flag-burning is generally more along the lines of:

"HAHAHA, I AM BURNING YOUR FLAG!"

"...well, no. That's not my flag, is it? My flag is a pair of pants I got for during the football. That's your flag. On fire. Was it expensive?"


There was a recent conversation about flag-burning, where we came to the conculsion that people who like burning flags in outrage have got filing cabinets of different ones, in case a country upsets them, so they have an appropriate one to hand. Apparently during the whole cartoons and demark think, a lot of not!danish flags got burnt because the danish flag looks like quite a few others :P